Former General Secretary of Labour Leave Brendan Chilton joined James Whale and Ash on their show to discuss the state of Brexit and the benefits of leaving …
Tony Benn on the EU
“I can think of no body of men outside the Kremlin who have so much power without a shred of accountability for what they do”
On Thursday 23rd June 2016, the people of this country will be asked a question that nobody has asked them for 42 years: “Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union?
My answer to this question will be to leave the undemocratic European Union unequivocally. There are very few politicians who I hold in high esteem and one of those politician is the late Mr Tony Benn who said “If you cannot get rid of the people who govern you, you do not live in a democratic system,” who was a lifelong opponent of rule from Brussels.
This is a once in a life time opportunity to say I believe in an independent democratic Britain that can and will prosper without being part of this expensive undemocratic authoritarian federal Superstate. If the people of Great Britain decide not to leave we will regret and lament for this grave mistake and our children and their children will suffer immensely due to this decision.
Tony Benn Tony a grits go on tonight cause smokers on many platforms welcome back to our platform here's the microphone right thanks Ron it's a very big issue this whatever view you take of it it is a very very big decision and I very glad Keith Edwards in favor of its come out in favor of the European Enterprise has come out favor of this and this idea that you're only in favor of democracy if you if you think you're going to win the argument is a completely irrelevant oh can I just look back on my thoughts about this to explain the position that I'm in I was born after the First World War Second World War the combination 110 hundred five million people died and there are people say we could never fight again in Europe and I agree with him 100% I do not want the old naturalist Europe where you hate foreigners so that's the argument for cooperation and I take that view I'm strongly in favor of cooperating with Europe I was for a time well I campaigned for the referendum if you know this I own him I was in the minority one on the National Executive in the shadow cabinet in 71 they didn't want a referendum but in the end we've got a referendum after we've gone in and we lost it and then I was on the Council of Ministers and that was a most shattering experience they're living in my life because I was the representative of Britain and for six months I was the President of the Council of of energy ministers I wasn't allowed to submit a document only the Commission for bureaucrats could submit a document I could say yes or no sort of a constitutional monarch if you like they control it mate in secret it made laws for Britain and every worth inmate in secret and when I suggested we met in public or nearly strangled me because all their dirty little deals would have come out and so I the more I thought about this and this is what it's about now it is about democracy remember this I was a member for 51 years members of parliament are lent the powers of their constituents and they have to return those powers and diminished at the end it's not for members of parliament to give away the powers that will link to them because they don't belong to members of parliament they belong to the electorate and that is a critical matter and now I say something else I mean we're probably concerned with Britain but it terrifies me that Germany didn't allow its own people to have a referendum and with a journalist would enter the european union and have the treaty and you know in before the war Hitler wasn't exactly a Democrat and that practice of it everything being decided at the top has been carried on to that France they had a referendum defeated it and now Sarkozy is trying to bypass it and we live in a continent where increasingly power has gone to a group of people are not elected cannot be removed and don't have to listen to us I mean Mandelson's a very powerful man he wasn't even elected by the House of Commons Blair appointed him under the royal prerogative and Mandelson doesn't have to listen to us with all the defects of our democracy the reason governments listen to people is because you you get your power from the people I mean being an MP you know this weird a very unusual position you're one employee in 60,000 employers everyone in your constituency employs you the bus driver the street sweeper the home help the policemen the employer you could say what your life and always have done but they get rid of you because I'm because it get rid of you you have to listen to the Madison doesn't evolution anymore it and it is the most bureaucratic terrifying system in the world and it's being imposed on us on the ground is tidying up I must save tidying up involves tearing up the British constitutional that's an interesting definition of tidying up and I think this argument is an overwhelming argument now there are other views of Europe as I say I don't know back to the old nationalism because of the bloodshed that was a took place you could have a United States in Europe you could have a president and a Congress and a House of Representatives I mean at every holy and will be but couldn't complain about you after all America isn't governed by commercials you want this country governed by commission you could apply the European got using to Britain and you'd find they were commissioners and we don't even elect your appear members of parliament do you realize that you vote for the party I can't write to an MEP and I won't vote for you're going to write back say Tony you never vote you in the first place you voted for the party in Blair decides who is the candidate so the thing is absolutely undemocratic and the effect of it of course is to create a lot of hostility to it which means it won't work anywhere I'll tell you one thing even if I believed in it I think this system will end up with the breakup of the European Union like Yugoslavia and I do not want that happen either I do not want to find we go back to hostility based on blaming the French or blaming the the Italians or the Germans because what's wrong is the system is wrong and that is what we have to prevent now how do you win the argument well I mean I listen to all this stuff that this week about going to participate more the manifesto is going to be put out to a referendum will manifest says only lasts for a couple years but this decision is far more important than the next labor manifesto because he decides who governs what my god system and there was a glow over whelming argument and the all stood for absolutely right of course the reason they do wonder they wouldn't carry the day you couldn't carry the day and so this is the argument now if I I'm not a great moderniser if that means privatization and the rest of it but I must say pets we should come up with the idea of modernizing the European Union by which I mean restoring power to the member states to cooperate I'm not in a next release I mean I'm not either about you I'm not in favor of Scottish Parliament if you are well it is a Scottish Parliament they'll love it in Brussels because they'd be easier to control if there's a Scottish Parliament my mother is a Scot I'm going to Scotland I'm going to lead a campaign for the independence of the kingdom of Fife again sitting right I don't think nationalism is the answer to lack of democracy the answer to lack of democracy is more democracy and you know what I'm it recovery is with you if this all goes through Gordon Brown will be the Prime Minister Britain you'll be the mayor of the Greater British Authority like Kayla vixen well it is I mean he won't have the power to do what he want to do because those decisions will be taken elsewhere and so it's the destruction of our domestic democracy as well as a European arrangement that is undemocratic that really worries me very very much indeed and I think we've got to think this out very very carefully but if we put a serious argument everybody wants to cooperate with Europe of course they do but cooperation on the basis that you put up proposals for harmonization and the nation states decide which of those proposals they will adhere to it will be slower it'll be more difficult but by God in the end you'll be sure that every single harmonization law has been consented to by the Parliament and can be repealed by succeeding Parliament now one last point I think what we're seeing in Europe is the beginning of a much much bigger and more dangerous trend the death of democracy generally leave aside for a moment Brussels the IMF is not elected by the money World Trade Organization not elected anybody multinational corporations are more powerful the nation sex they're not they're not elected by anybody the central bank in Frankfurt not elected by anybody and funnily enough one of the most successful countries in the world is Norway Norway why they're successful I tell you why they nationalized their oil when I was energy Minister I managed to get hold of 20% of the North Sea oil which Thatcher sold off but Norway got the lot and I thought it was a Swiss General the other day I don't normally talk to generals but he happened to come and have a chat to me and they have the referendum as the basis of the principle and they said we're never going to go into the European Union and you see we don't have to go this way this idea there's no alternative in mrs. Thatcher's phrases it's completely untrue we have a choice it's an important choice and we're making a democratic argument that should appeal to people of all opinions not just political opinions but even those in favor of the new pretty should have the guts to say no very I'm in favor of it I'm in favor of it being introduced by the consent of the British people so I think the challenge to democracy is a big one we've seen a bit of it at this conference very interesting conferences no resolutions and no bookshop you can't hear anybody's ideas the only book you can read by the way is jump Alastair Campbell book it's been sold at the party headquarters back when it was funny enough when it was Alison Campbell book came out I thought there'd be a Harry Potter queue outside the bookshop so I got there early case they will sold out nobody there and I said to the girl if we got the Blair yes and she said how do you spell Blair that's on how that somehow said it all comrades we've got a very important are just like the Chartists and the suffragettes we're about democracy and democracy will be fatally damaged in Britain and in Europe if we go along with the system that has no firm democratic babes all they're going to say I tried not to be controversial at 82 in our try just to put simple arguments but I fully support the safeguards committee John's reports a brilliant I don't know if you collect them but I've kept every one he's ever written I'm going to publish the collected works of John Mills one day because it says the whole case acts so clearly on Austin's championship or others Peter Shaw would have been wrong a platform over here today so thank you for asking me I'm sorry I've got four more fringes but when you've retired everyone rings you up and says will you do a meeting issue to think you've got nothing to do so I'm going to slip off to them but thank you for asking me and I think we have a good chance of winning this because the public of with us and you can't defy the public forever on really big issues thank you for listening you
Steven Woolfe, Lord Digby Jones, John Mills and John Longworth are interviewed by Inside Europe.
is the UK ready to walk away with a No Deal unless the EU gets real over brexit four prominent voices from the world of business and politics are meeting with the EU chief negotiator Michel Barnier today to answer that question they all join me now MEP Stephen wolf X CBI head Lord Digby Jones ley believe chairman John Mills and former British Chamber of Commerce Chief John Longworth now Steven let's start with you Stephen wolf I should say in terms of the momentum behind this what you see is the fundamental aim of today I think there are three key aims one is to make sure that Barney a understands that there is an iron will to continue and make sure that brexit actually happens and those who are trying to delay deny or damage brexit will fail the second point is to offer a hand of friendship to those in the European Union to say that we're seeking to get a good deal but thirdly and more importantly if there is no good deal which includes services in the free trade arrangement then we mustn't be frightened of leaving without a deal having a no deal and working on WTO trade deals and of course the element of the WTO trade deals we all go down the hard brexit route is going to be apocalyptic it's going to be the end of the world in terms of that John Longworth you know do you see that as a credible proposition that it's going to be somehow massively negative it's you know there's no point even considering it because it's just that bad no it's actually nonsense that it would be that bad you know III kocho an organization called leave means leave which represents a wide business community has some of the top business people in the UK involved in it and we are absolutely convinced along with our economists that the UK will do well whether or not we have a trade deal with the European Union provided we maintain our freedoms to manage the economy in a way that we want to obviously a trade deal with the European Union would be helpful particularly to the European Union if they want access to the UK market but the fact of matter is that the UK can do well even without a trade deal what do you make of the lines coming out from someone like Michelle Barney a particularly on let's say passport in financial services which is very much at a distance there is going be no real corporation it seems on rights of passport Inge and and in terms of financial service the financial service sector is that fundamentally a poor position for the e2b going there for mister Barnea to be going down it's a very poor position for the EU because London is Europe's banker of London of course is a major financial center for the world but the fact the matter is that the EU governments and businesses need to access the deep and wide capital markets in the in London in the city of London the expertise that's there the legal system and so on so it's actually very important for the EU that access to those markets is available and you know only nine percent of the city's activity has any association with passport in whatsoever which is a very small proportion of the UK economy and is that something you're going to be reminding mr. Bernier in your meeting a little lately Lord DB Jones in terms of the context around this obviously they've been several meetings mr. Bernier has had some of whom from people like Nick Clegg people like Tony Blair all of whom perhaps will go with a message which is starkly different from what you're going to be putting forward to it to him have you been concerned about the echo chamber effect perhaps well of these negotiations it's not about what I'm concerned it's about what firstly 18 million people are concerned will actually voted one way but secondly so many small businesses who I am in touch with around the country who are absolutely fed up with what I would call the ABC faction which is a Donis Blair Clegg and and they think they speak for the country and I really their arrogance it takes my breath away which is at the end of the day there's a type of tyranny in this where they're basically saying no no no no we speak for it and of course because they are public figures with with with good quality service track records what they are is getting access they get air time they get in to see people like Bernie a and therefore I'm worried that people like Michele Barney I think that they speak for Britain they do not and I would much rather and I hear this so often from businesses around the country I I would much rather people was saying to business of Britain David Davis was saying too bit to business we're gonna start with No Deal and he's now for Michel Barnier to come to us and say what do you see a trade deal like because there's an unemployed kid in Athens today there's a single mum in Madrid today who needs a job and the only way they're really gonna get a job if wealth is created and the only way you're going to create wealth is international trade and the biggest best trade deal I can think that Germany could make is with the United Kingdom now on that basis mr. Bernier please put the politics aside on this and start looking after the 520 million of the EU 28 which we are at the moment to make sure that the trade deal with your biggest trading partner in ours works a treat that is where I'd like to start and what would you say if he came back and said look I hear your voice but your voice is one of the many I thought and I've heard that former Prime Minister come iphoto former Deputy Prime Minister comes to my door and they've said something completely different you so why should I take your word for it when I could listen to those people I don't think it's about whether take word because I'm representative of businesses but not officially and by the way Tony Blair hasn't got a job so as far as I understand it he is no more representative than me he's expressing a personal view and thank God we live in a world where he can I'm very pleased about that wait is that too much wait and I know why he's a former prime minister and and he's got access that I could never dream of having but by the way he shouldn't abuse that access when you think that there's a small business sitting in small businesswoman sitting in New Castle tonight employing 20 people house on the line what she's after is a trade deal mr. Blair she's not after trying to say this is all up in the air for two years while I try and destroy the whole thing and adapt to tyranny against the will of the people I mean John Mills obviously you're from labor leave yes that's right from a party which is fairly ambiguous about actually what it wants out of Briggs that were indeed whether it once breaks it one of the moment men were reasons you're coming here when the momentum behind it is to represent the 52% of the people some of whom obviously will come from the labour constituencies the labour supporters historic labour supporters who voted leave how are you going to convey that message to mr. Varney a in the meeting well I think there's some important statistics that really bear this out very strong in one more generally not just with labor people was published recently showing that 48% of the population of strongly supporting brexit 39% are against in the moment 13% undecided but I mean that's a big majority in favor of pressing on and getting the brexit out of the way but if you look at the labor side of things the last election nearly 40% of Labor voters in the previous general election voted for leave and I think there's a real problem in the neighbor party which is at the Parliament parliamentary representations we've got the Labour MPs don't really represent the views of large numbers of working people and essentially labour voters it's neat because again in terms of the the Labour Party as a whole if you were to as I'm sure you did as I did go to party conference for example and you you heard the mood of the the conventions and the fringe events it was all dominated by a remain attitude and the assumption that everyone who sports laboriously when you're saying fundamentally as with a number of the country you're going to be saying to aspire there's a large number of people who are simply not being represented by the two parties and the jeremy corbyn in series may who are coming to you and giving you representation I think that's fine just again to give you another example I mean we sent out a tweet to the Labour leave supporters yesterday and we had 2,000 people coming back to us overnight with views that needed to be expressed to mr. Bernier this afternoon I mean there's a tremendously strong feeling among labour supporters that a very substantial portion of them anyway that we want to get on with Brett said make a success of it stay friends with Europe but get it done and you know he's interesting when this news of this visit by us came out I've had loads and loads of communication from various places saying please tell mr. Bernier the quicker we can get out the better for everybody including Europe but one was from Anna German entrepreneur in düsseldorf he's just invested 75 million euros of his own money not threatened take me in northwest England into a facility that he's doing because Britain's coming out of the EU so that he can use Britain as a gateway to the world as opposed to a gateway out of Germany now if you add the people John was talking about so this sort of guy who's got nothing to do with the British economy at the we speak there is a there is a reservoir of hidden unrepresented people who have had enough and the quicker we get this done I would submit its it you EU wants to move on doesn't it the EU wants to move on with all its challenges over the next ten years and so does the United Kingdom and I think we're here to say come on let's get it done but by the way mr. Bernier we're starting with we're coming out No Deal now tell me how you can persuade me we ought to do a deal Stephen one thing that you've you've been quoted as saying is is this is the sort of a leave fight back and obviously you're coming here and indeed you all are because you're in some way concerned or worried about where the negotiations are in terms of a deal in terms of with the momentum from the UK when you say leave fight back what do you mean because the assumption there is that the government is not being strong enough with the EU and is allowing them to some extent to exude an arrogance and perhaps take the mick in terms of sufficient progress in terms of the what they're suggesting the future arrangements will look like I think they're probably not be allowed to say take the mick anymore be honest with someone from an Irish background we'd enjoy that but of course there has been a strong attitude from lots of people and digby has talked about the ABCs here of those who have tried to delay deny and damage brexit and and I think one of the important parts that we have to say is that this cross-party group of people we were looking at left and right and centre they didn't covers business is a challenge to that narrative and when we talk about the labor at the kind of leave movement fight back just before Christmas there was a petition to leave the European Union being presented to the Commons on a No Deal basis that reached a hundred thousand within a few days of us launching that and getting that out today we've seen others coming out to the European Parliament we've our meeting at the weekend the a number of meetings across the country I'm speaking at one on Sunday in London where there's going to be rallies to suggest that the leave movement is not over and that they will not have it the remainders will not have it their own way throughout 2018 this is not a battle that has been lost by the levers it's a battle that's being lost by the remainer and they should wake up and recognize that in order to support Britain jobs and a thriving economy leave their past battles behind get behind the government get a good deal and then we'll move forward the jority of former remain is that I meet ticking the business community now just want to get on and do the deal of leaving you know leave means leave has 90,000 supporters and we actually reach 2 million people every day on social media it's a huge movement to leave the European when you say it's being unrepresented in terms of the way the brig's and negotiations then the momentum in the mood in terms of the country from the media as being portrayed you think that these uh these people these millions of people who are engaged in the leave movement well of course this is the UK problem you know the Metropolitan elite the the Westminster bubble in the UK represent often the views of the people within that bubble a major part of that of course well we have to say to mr. Burnley we have to actually be honest and say that there's a huge issue of a debate within the UK and it's not for Barney a to necessarily resolve that but it is in the interests of the European Union and the people of the European Union that they make it possible for the UK to smoothly leave the European Union quickly and to settle these matters in the interests of all parties have you noticed if you look at the propaganda sheet that used to be known as the Financial Times and on the front page which I always thought was a paragon of neutral reporting on the front page any bit of good UK economic news starts with the words despite brexit if you ever listen to the BBC any bit of good economic news starts with the words despite brexit and by the way I exaggerated to make the point and I'm sure they'll give me instances whether it hasn't happen but the concept is that they create this atmosphere that for some reason we're all going to hell in a handbasket if we don't give in and I want I want mr. Bernier this afternoon to understand we are all on the same side here we need a trade deal for the good of Europe he needs a trade deal for the good of Europe we need a trade deal crew the good of Britain and so does he and I want to stop the antagonism which is the polemic of yes and no this should be coming together and actually saying how can we quickly to give stability get into a trade deal that helps that unemployed kid in Athens as much as it helps the woman in your castle on time I may say some and I think one of the problems that we've got is to be the people like brown and doughnuts give the impression that we're so desperate to stay in the single market and the customs union that we weaken our negotiating position in Brussels and I think there's some real danger that the European Union will overestimate the problems in brexit and at the termination of the British people to go through with the door and we'll finish up with a standoff which we don't really need it'd be far better to come to a reasonable agreement we've got recognising from their perspective how strong the feeling in this column in the UK they were trying to undermine the government's negotiating position doesn't mean that the EU should underestimate the determination of the UK's elite and that actually no trade deal is better than a bad trade deal the UK will do very well outside the European Union with or without a trade deal okay before you all then head off to the European Commission to see mr. Barney I'll just take each one of you if you were to when we get when you get to this meeting and you learn you'll speak to mr. Barney the one thing then one sentence you want to say to him to reinforce your each individual messages perhaps even we'll start with you what was the one thing you want to get across to mr. Barney here today that he agrees that brexit it means brexit it will happen and there'll be no turning back Joe else that it's hugely in the –use interest to do a reasonable deal with us and not to try and drive such a hard bargain that in the end it all falls apart nor Debbie James the services has to be part of that deal and mr. Bernier cannot cherry-pick this and financial services has to be within the trade deal that it's in everybody's interest to reach a swift conclusion that we need for the certainty of business across Europe to have clarity either way by the summer
Steven is interviewed on BBC Daily Politics on unifying Brexiteers and countering the rhetoric from those seeking to stop Brexit altogether.
exit the report which carries the byline of Teresa Mays former advisor Nick Timothy is about the plan by one remain supporting campaign group to try and bring about a second referendum to keep Britain in the EU well the former you keep MEP Stephen wolf has claimed that what he calls ultra remainer czar now speaking with a single voice and once leave campaigners to do the same he joins me now from Strasbourg Stephen wolf I don't quite understand what you're worried about initial running scared from a remain campaign then perhaps is doing exactly the same as the leave campaign did ahead of the referendum no what I was concerned about is that the remainders are what I call the ultra Mainers as you've just heard with Alastair Campbell really don't want to listen to voters and what they've done since that referendum has been incredibly well organized they've managed to get their people in places to be able to articulate their view there this will be a disaster that leaving the European Union will cause immense problems in the future and also they're incredibly well-funded and as you can see from today's newspapers what you have is a uk-based organisation accepting a large donation from a non UK banking billionaire I mean to be frank that reminds me a little bit of the rodolfo plot in 1571 where we had a Florentine banker trying to help the team assassinate Elizabeth the first so this is not the first time no rolling political campaigns is hardly new is it Steven wolf I mean this is nothing secret about it they're hiding in plain sight I mean the complaints you're making you could say look the leave campaign was a pretty aggressive legitimate campaign that wanted to leave the EU and the government has said that the country will leave the EU you were part of a campaign that wanted the government to rule out the possibility of staying in the single market well they've said that's going to happen and the same with the customs union so where do you think these ultra remain as you call them are taking a lead on setting the agenda for brexit I think what you do you hear is when I go up and down the country which I still do and I attend meetings and speak to order people though incredibly fed up by the negative that seems to be on the media particularly and not just shows like this but on the television and in all different ways that seems to say that the leave votes is a particularly bad scenario and they don't feel that they've had their voice of a really positive Britain that could happen after we leave the European Union and that's why I also wrote in the independent that not only do we need to bring all the teams together of the the various leave groups well actually try to articulate a very strong positive message and I've argued that we should have a kind of low regulation singapore-style type of economy moving forward which we includes all the key four points that we wanted control of our borders ensuring that we have our money back and being able to distribute that in the right places making sure that European courts of justice is no longer in control and democracy is with our people not those who have you got support to bring everyone together have you got support for everyone and all these groups two people are together well I've certainly been talking to them and you saw with my actions taking Lord Digby Jones and John Longworth from leave means leave and also labour leave in in John Mills I've spoken to a number of people from a different groups and we've been pulling together right and I think that you'll see some more action on this front coming forward in the next few weeks right do you need Nigel for us to come and lead it sorry I miss I miss that terribly sorry do you need Nigel Faraj to come back and lead this new group that you want to put together no absolutely not I think Nigel as has taken a very different routes of course he still articulates leaving the European Union and he's a strong voice but I think most people are now seeing Nigel as someone who's more interested in being in the media and a part of a personality and of course what I think we need to look at now is those people have experience in having to deal with the economy of Britain those who need to create the laws across a whole spectrum of policy issues that concern British the British public those are the people with experience that you've got and of course in UK politics and the Conservative Party you have the EOG yes and they've been leading this very strong Jacob Riis mogs and others like that and I think that's a very positive part too right would you like Jacob Riis Mach perhaps to lead this group you sound pretty enthused by him as the new leader of the European research group would he be the answer well I think Jacob Riis Nord is doing a sterling job with the ERG and all the other conservative MPs who are backing brexit to the hill I think they would obviously be part of this group but this is a message I'm trying to say is over the next four to six weeks where I believe we've got a mission critical timing ahead of us because of what I see here in the European Parliament in relation to the votes that are needed in the way that the Commission is pulling together a whole series of papers that we need to challenge that and put forward some very positive message all right I know for example that one one group is bringing a really strong message of how Britain would be successful in a big way in financial services if we adopt a certain set of criteria right just before I come to you Angela Smith Aran banks is outfit leave dot EU is now encouraging former UK party members to join the Conservative Party saying last month maybe by flooding back into the Conservative Party we can change the course of history again do you agree with Aaron banks well I think Aaron has obviously seen some very you know he through the people that he speaks to in his group the decision here that there is no political party challenging the Labour Party all those in the ultra remainer groups that can say that Britain is in a bad way and I thought about I think they have to take their own decision of whether they feel that if they're a labor supporter they've come back people like John Mills and the Labour leave group and Kate Hui and those who've done a good job and those who feel like like myself we're small see conservatives those who believe in a different vision for Britain should help the Conservative Party group that are fighting for brexit but both sides need to make it cross party this is a national issue of the future okay and I think that we need to have people from different political parties working together on different fronts to attack the ultra remaineth right the ultra are you an ultra remain as extraordinary interview wasn't it really and for somebody who they've won it want everyone together but not if not quite happy boy I want Nigel Farraj but then this was the the leave campaign won the referendum and now they seem to be in some kind of panic let's all get together and I suspect it's because people are rejecting that kind of extremist brexit that we've heard articulated and sort of a lack of confidence in the government to deliver any form of praxis it's also I don't remember trying but I think he's on pretty much a lost cause for hard brexit Stephen what do you say well I think there we go once again with the language of of there the extremists brexit language and this is not very helpful this is the sort of language that has been used where we've Cole said that the old are destroying the lives of the young people that we should say you know those who voted leave a xenophobia racism really it's quite a disgraceful stance for people like yourself to take that view we have an economy that it can and will move forward successfully in the future if you will if that's the case the economy will do so well from your from a brexit why is all the evidence that the government tries to suppress showing the opposite and I've never been called an extremist in before in my life so I find that quite amusing as well Stephen well what we have seen is that during the referendum campaign we had these sorts of economic reports suggesting from even than the Chancellor that would lose 400,000 jobs that we'd have an emergency budget and this is exactly the same type of argument in the economics and what we have seen is actually more people in work less people unemployed we've seen increases in the successful in terms of manufacturing in lots of different sectors of and of course we haven't left but you can't have your cake and eat it and say for one thing we haven't left them the economy is growing and then suggest but I said quick enough all right and that is the type of argument you put forward we're going to have to end it there I can't remember how many times people say have your cake and eat it and one day we will Stephen thank you very much for joining us and for more reporting and analysis is of brexit check out the BBC News website that's be